New Terrain.. how?

[Tazz]

I've been walking around with this idea for ages now .. I would *love* a Cold War (turns hot) mid 80's European (Germany/Poland) theater! I don't know if the whole of Western/Easter Germany and parts of Poland, Holland, Belgium etc will fit, if not I'd settle for just East + West Germany.

I have tons of books here on ORBAT's of the mid 80's, both NATO/USA and Sovjet/DDR forces, lots of ideas, creativity.. but not a clue where to start.

If someone would want to help out - or rather if someone is already working on this, I'd love hop aboard and help out. Or if someone could point me into the right direction I'd really appreciate it!

[Snake Man]

quote:Originally posted by Tazz:
I would *love* a Cold War (turns hot) mid 80's European (Germany/Poland) theater! I don't know if the whole of Western/Easter Germany and parts of Poland, Holland, Belgium etc will fit, if not I'd settle for just East + West Germany.

If someone would want to help out - or rather if someone is already working on this, I'd love hop aboard and help out. Or if someone could point me into the right direction I'd really appreciate it!

Hows that look, its not done with the spherical converter so its a bit curved, but anyway you'll get the idea.

If that does not suit for the '80s euro cold war theater, let me know of which coordinates would and I'll create the map.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

[Tazz]

Assuming a classic German front, Italy won't be much of a player. I'd say.. move the map a bit more to the right, showing more of the DDR/Poland and a bit north, showing more of Denmark. Looks mighty fine already!

[Snake Man]

quote:Originally posted by Tazz:
I'd say.. move the map a bit more to the right, showing more of the DDR/Poland and a bit north, showing more of Denmark.

http://www.aquarius.geomar.de/omc/make_map.html

In that link you can create map yourself, after you are satisfied with the location (make it 10 x 10 degrees) sent me the coordinates you used and I'll create that terrain file for you, autotiled or plain.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

[brewskie]

The cold war we grew up with turning hot,
gives me goose pimples.

[Tazz]

Anyone I can get interested in helping out? I have no idea what to do but I want to make it nevertheless!

I propose 1985, deadsmack mid 80's or perhaps somewhat later 80s (would enable us to use SU-27's based in Poland). Have to look into that. But I think it would be awesome to fly and fight over East and West Germany, Poland and the low lands!

[T Bone]

I can help in creating new tile graphics. I'll tell you one thing, Northern Europe is NOTHING like Korea so you guys aren't gonna get away with using the Korean tiles so easily this time

[Tazz]

I live in Holland and Germany, been in Eastern Germany and Poland quite a few times so atleast I have some visual reference

I think this could be a very interesting theater!

[Tazz]

How do you get that nice map? From that site all I get are yellowish/blueish maps?

[Snake Man]

quote:Originally posted by Tazz:
How do you get that nice map? From that site all I get are yellowish/blueish maps?

Just tell me the long/lat coordinates of the 10 x 10 degree area of where you want the theater.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

[Tazz]

10x10 is a bit tight, still shoving it around.. see if I want more of the low countries or more of Hungary/Poland in the map.

Depends on the Soviet ORBAT in Poland/Hungary.

[ccc]

Seems Red Storm is rising!
Dont worry Tazz, you can get help here.
BTW, dont worry too much about terrain tiling..the latest auto-tiling tool is very powerful.
hehe I think my Mig1.44 MFI 3d model finds its theater

[Tazz]

CCC:

Well not really, it's mid 80's to late 80s.

But I could really use a MiG-27, Su-24 and Su-17 models. Any idea if someone is working on those?

[Snake Man]

quote:Originally posted by Tazz:
10x10 is a bit tight, still shoving it around..

Well I can create 128 x 128 segment map for you, thats 20 by 20 degrees (should cover europe easily). But only one problem, there is still not solution for the TE/Instant/Campaign map image sizes, everytime you load large map up you'll cut out all objects from the range of 1024 x 1024.

But... there will be solution, yeah I've been mumbling about this for months now. Somehow I got the feeling that were going to get this problem solved in few weeks! and that is great.

Anyway, if you're ambitious the choice is 128 segment map. If you play safe, you get geeky small 64 segment (default) sized map

PMC TFW
Snake Man

[Tazz]

Well if we want a full realistic European cold war map, 10x10 won't really cut it. Even when I toss the low lands out, we still miss large parts of Poland and Hungary. Important bases would fall off the map.

On the other hand, if we take realism a little lighter (like most people would actually know where Finsterwalde, Templin, Oranienburg etc would be ), 10x10 would do and I would be able to sneak in the russian bases in Eastern Germany, Poland and Hungary.

I think we should just stick with the Soviet AF because we might run into skin problems if we also want the Polish, Eastern Germany and Hungarian MiGs in there as well. Unless someone has a solution for having MiG-23's in *4* different skins?

[ccc]

quote:Originally posted by Tazz:
I think we should just stick with the Soviet AF because we might run into skin problems if we also want the Polish, Eastern Germany and Hungarian MiGs in there as well. Unless someone has a solution for having MiG-23's in *4* different skins?

Dont worry about that. I feel it will be solve at last. sooner or later. Balkan theater also works for the same problem, they got Vipers from many countries!
As for new 3d models of cold war fighters, once 3d importing comes true, you'll got them.

[Tazz]

I've decided to drop Hungary/Czech, it wouldn't really fit on a 10x10 map. I think West and East Germany will make a nice battleground.

I'm already making an ORBAT (Order of Battle) for both sides.

North: 57 South: 48
East: 6 West: 16

[Tazz]

Poland just went out as well. To atleast include some of the Polish bases, I'd have to switch to East 7 degrees, West 17 degrees to keep an 10x10 map. This would mean that the crucial USAFE bases of Spangdahlem and Bitburg would no longer fit on the map. Also the German base of Hopsten would also 'fall off' the map.

So no Poland. I know that in 1987 there was a Su-27 regiment in Poland. I just don't know if there was one in Eastern Germany as well. I think there was, it then got pulled back and replaced with Su-24 Fencers. I just can't remember where I read that.. *frown*. I'll work it out, don't worry.

If we could use 20x20 we could have all out warfar in Europe but for now, a German Cold War theater would also do very nicely.

[This message has been edited by Tazz (edited January 01, 2001).]

[Tazz]

Aha! Just found the ORBAT (Order of Battle) of the 4th Soviet Air Force, based in Poland.

That included 2 Su-27 regiments (159 IAP at Kluczewo and 582 IAP at Chojna)! Now these two bases definitely won't fit on a 10x10 map with Germany in there. However, according to the 4th Soviet AF "battle plan", these two Su-27 units would deploy to Damgarten and Juterbog in Eastern Germany.

This way I can still have the Su-27s in the theater and a very high level of realism.

[ccc]

wow, cant believe your info!
so what's their camo scheme? armament? quantity?

BTW, it used to be called OOB ?


[This message has been edited by ccc (edited January 01, 2001).]

[Tazz]

OOB = Order Of Battle
ORBAT = ORder of BATtle.

I'm an aviation photographer and we use always ORBAT but OOB is a more military term.

I could scan some pics of the SU-27s if you like. Their camoflage is the 'regular' Soviet 'blueish' Flanker camo with a weird blue/white wingmarking on the tail, a red stair in the tail, 2 digit red/white-outlined bord number in the tail and on the nose. There are several SU-27s with white noses and a bunch with dark green/greish noses. Bord numbers for the 159 IAP at Kluczewo are in the 20 - 30 range with several in the 60 range.

Now I have a problem. I downloaded my DEM data (hdr file, fmt file and bin file) but when I try to convert them with DEM_2_L2.exe I get a error at line 2100 of 4000. Any idea?