Panama FF/RV Installer

[Malc]

For info everyone, SM now has all the source files and will hopefully be very soon making a Red Viper/FreeFalcon compatible version!

I look forward to it as muchas anyone!

[Snake Man]

Downloading the packet now. I can't make any promises when the installer will be ready.

Just to be clear, I'll be making the installer as all the others, for AF, RV and OF... then there is just 1 installer to download for any Falcon user.

Of course I cant vouch how good the theater works on OF (I cant run 3d), etc. But at least the files are together.

[derStef]

Great!

Snake Man, i wish you the best and good luck!


cheers
Stef

[ccc]

A BIG THANX to Fafa!

I know, ppl are moving to FF5. I just want to have a look in FF4/RV environment and do some tweaks(just for fun).

Thanks to Fafa, he packed a 138mb rar for me.. terrain uses dds tiles and normals are fixed.. it's not a slim installer, just a rar of file folders.. i created Panama folder, drop them in and done.

now pics.. first, it shows in theater list..

small bug, the right upper corner map about 1/4 size..

in TE, i create a new TE but.. i have no ac to select.. tho i use teplane.lst from other theater, it won't work.

this is 2d map in TE..too small.

there's a TE-freeflight can be selected, and it got flyable F-16, so i took a ride over the canal area - wow! nice! i also noted some new tiles by Malc.. nice indeed.
here's campaign menu - ya, some bugs.. and i knew all cam won't work due to DB issue..once i tick one, it CTD.

following is the tdf file.. i fix a line..about objectdir.

Code: Select all

# Panama TDF file

# shown in the pick list
name Panama 

# Title shown on theater page
desc Panama Theater of Operations

# bitmap to display on theater page
bitmap Theaters\Panama\Panama.tga

# in general, you can miss out most of these, and it
# will use the default, unless another theater changes it
# so probably best to put in explicitly.
 
# Where the campaign directory is
campaigndir Theaters\Panama\campaign

# where the terrain data is
terraindir Theaters\Panama\Terrdata

# where art is loaded from
artdir Theaters\Panama\art

# movies
#moviedir movies

# uisounds 
uisounddir sounds

# default objects
objectdir terrdata\objects

# misc textures
misctexdir Theaters\Panama\terrdata\misctex

# 3d object files
3ddatadir terrdata\objects

# minimum tacan channel
mintacan 1

# sounds dir
sounddir sounds

[ccc]

thanx to Fafa again - i got an updated lcktxtrc.irc file..

now TE can select all ac!

and ALL three campaigns are working!! movies are played too.

excellent

now i hope the maps could be the right size.

Edit - the second campaign ( Just cause 2, save0.cam) not working , just CTD. the rest two are ok.

[Fafa]

Hi
The campaign Ctd are a result between a campaign edition made for OF or AF DB. It is a miracle if some are working.

Now I think I'll make a new campaign one day more compatible than that but I am on Aegean stuff ATM and working very slowly...

Now a good scenario should be Cruzex 2010 on Panama Theater...

img]http://i590.photobucket.com/albums/ss34 ... ruzex1.jpg[/img]
img]http://i590.photobucket.com/albums/ss34 ... ruzex2.jpg[/img]
img]http://i590.photobucket.com/albums/ss34 ... F2000C.jpg[/img]

[ccc]

wow.. nice screenshots!! cool skins... tho i don't remember Brazil operating m2k..

say, an [ US vs latin america force] campaign should be really cool

[ccc]

Testing the first campaign, Hell's Fury( Save2.cm)..

- no CTD so far.. the cam Obj id seems fit FF4 DB.
- Red side has few SA-5 sites.. then more SA-10 ! show up later.
- the Red air hostiles are mig29(GAF one) and su27 !
- main Red ground force is infantry units..they are moving toward Rio Santa right now.
- Blue side has 4-5 armoured units as reinforcement.. i noted they are moving really fast.. to guard the only blue AFB on panama land.
- Once wiping out red Long-range SAMs, i start hammering red ground units, and down the number from 700+ to 250 in half day..minimal resistance.
- Blue side remains defensive.. the win condition is capturing Panama city and San Cristobal.

[ccc]

the war continues..

- more blue M1A1 units arrived, move fast to secure Chitre and AFB.
- several red infantry units moved to contact US marine around Rio santa junction..marines and airstrike neutralized the attack.
- on day 2100, blue started major offensive to Santiago. five-six M1A1 units joined the offensive from Chitre. and "many" red infantry defended Santiago.. after fierce fighting, US captured Santiago. then the war entered another cosolidation status.
- once i catpured Santiago, a movie played - China joined the war.. well, it must be Mexico or somebody else.. anyway, i did not notice any hostile forces showed up yet.. great, it proves the TRI file work properly.
- meanwhile, i manually ordered a M1 unit move NE to capture Rio Santa AFB, then Aguadulce, El cano, and got closer to Penonome/san Jose area. my next obj is San carlos, then Panama city. As i created a blue-owned route, several armour units followed it and reached Aquadulce, a good start for next offensive.
- air operation, so far the hositle ac are mig29 and su27, two types. AI ac did good job and disable most AFB for quite a long while, so i can highjacked some flights for covering ground op near Santiago.. red infantry units just spreaded out around the city, make fast-jet CAS not that effective. i noted AH-64 also helped CAS and SEAD/DEAD a lot.
- no AWACS at all.. well i supposed the carrier should have some E-2C.

[ccc]

the map pic shows the main combat route in this save2.cam... appearantly it follows the main highway in real world.


-the main blue base is Chitre.. the shortest route to Rio Santa junction( the upper blue box) is blocked due to a destroyed bridge. My bad, i failed to intercept a flight of mig-29 bombing the bridge in the begining of war.. thus my M1 units had to choose a longer way to Santiago.

- recon shows the hositle on the route from Penonome to Panama city are SAM/AAA units. the resistance should minimal

[ccc]

it's Day 3. I suddenly found that Blue side have to capture Panama city( at right hand side of map) AND San Cristobal ( at LEFT hand side of map) ...the theater- and its main combat route is basically East-West oriented, and blue side just started at the lower middle of Panama!
Campaign brain got to decide..attack San Critobal first, or Panama city first, or divide the ground force to capture both obj at the same time.. i doubt the AI can make decision..i've captured and secured Santiago for 2 days, and the second major offensive still aims at Santiago.

- the campaign seems a bit static..so i manually move one M1 unit toward Panama city.. resistance is minimal, and it moved all the way along the south coast to Canal area, crossed it, and reached the northern boundray of city area..well.. then the tank unit refused to move and take the obj!

- then, i decide to manually drive another M1 unit moving toward San Cristobal.. so far it halted near Tole AFB. the resistance from red side is AAA or SAM units..air cover neutralized them easily.

- BTW..i noted there's some new terrain tiles, looks great.

[ccc]

finally I manually order a M1 unit to capture [San Cristobbal], one of the objective to win at far west side of map.

To capture San Cristobal, i found a road bug near Tole / Tole AFB. First i want to move as RED line, crossing Tole AFB to the west.. M1 unit can not move further, just stuck at Tole AFB. Then, i chose the second way- WHITE route, it worked. The RED circle area needs a road fix.. or the way to Tole AFB will be a blind end.


After i got San Cristobal, i noted Air opeartion priority changed to Panama city, tho Ground op is Consolidation ATM. no blue ground units moving toward Panama city obj yet... it seems Blue side is short of ground units to secure captured obj, just no extra units for true offensive.

[ccc]

continue..

here's the overview of save2.cam combat route.. in white line. the yellow circles show key objectives.


- the starting points of blue sides are Chitre and Rio santa. units move to capture Santiago first.
- on Day 3-4, some tanks move to Aguadulac to secure it, then on Day 5-6, mechanized units defending Chitre move to capture El Valle, meanwhile Tank units at Aquadulac hopping to capture and secure La Chorrera, then some mechanized units pass tank units, move to capture Peurto Pilon city, followed by two infantry units. As you can see, campaign brain gives order to advance in some pattern.. but not aim at Panama city yet.
- i manually order one unit to capture San Cristobal at left hand side of map.. AI won't move to capture it.. without getting it, i can not meet the condition to win. so i do it myself by giving orders every 5 campaign minutes, at 16x.

- i've tried manually order a tank unit to capture panama city to end the war, for twice.. it just won't move into RED city area at all!! Damn on Day 7, run at 64x, i finally ordered one M1 unit to capture panama city..and end the war..great, movie played!!

so.. it's.. winable haha

some thoughts..
- San Cristobal is not on main combat route, and its priority only 20. better remove it from TRI win condition. Instead, Blue side can win by capturing Chitre, Santiago, El Valle, Panama city, and Colon.
- Colon area is RED city type terrain, i ordered tank units to take it for times, just no go.
- Enrique Aldofo Jimenze AFB, the X shape airbase at northern end of panama canal, can not be directly captured.. you've to capture nearby obj, then exit campaign, re-enter the campaign, and it suddenly turn blue. this obj is the same one as Wonson AFB.. probably due to road definition bug on dedicated AFB tiles.
- Both sides are short of ground units.. so the really A-G missions are sparse. need more units to secure obj, and provide more momentum for offensive.
- the timeout setting is 14 days, war tempo at 155. If i did not manually order a tank unit to capture last obj on Day 7.. i doubt AI can do the job before timout.

anyway..a promising mod.. i only cruising over 1/2 of the landmass.. there're more cool terrain at right half of map!
and, great job on terrain work, most tiles and road system are good.. tho some obj linkings are not streamlined.. which may make AI confusing- which road to pick for next step.

and last, TRI event do play the movies! great, i am told China and Russia joing the war - but no reinforcement arrived at all!!

[ccc]

continue..another campaign AI test..

As i wiped out all Red ground units, i let the campaign run at 64x time compression since Day 7.. this time i did not order a tank unit to catpure Panama city obj to end the war, just let AI do the job.

the result is.. the campaign clock stoped at Day 8 1550. No unit move to capture Panama city.
it does not seem to be a win/lose ending.. no movie played.. more like a Stalemate. the only noticable move since Day7 is, Two more infantry units reaching Peurto PIlion city to support three mechanized units. Campaign AI did not focus on right target.

[ccc]

SAVE1.cam, the third campaign in this package.. well i really hesitate to check it..

the overview map.. Blue on the left, has to capture THREE WHITE obj at far EAST end. Red on the right, has to capture TWO Yellow obj at far WEST end. Blue has around 2000+ vehicles, Red got 4400+.. and lots ac.

compared with first campaign/SAVE2.cam, this one is really tough.. for Blue side.

[ccc]

random thoughts and impressions about SAVE1.cam, the third campaign of Panama mod.

- As i found Red side has 4400+ vehicle, stronger airforces, and only TWO obj to capture for win, i joined the RED side..
run campaign at 16-64x till Day 3, well, most Blue AFB disabled, Blue ground units retreated, BUT RED units only secure Santiago and won't move further.. Because Blue ac has destroyed all bridges to the west end of map!! in FF4/RV, bridges can not be repaired.. so.. no open road to capture the two obj, no chance to win. OTOH, it means i have to pay lots attention, to stop any bridge-busters!

- while flying RED ac to strike Blue ground units, i calculated and tested the effectiveness of russian bombs..

for infantry unit, best use ZAB-500, or ZAB-250. then RBK-500/PTAB.
for armour/tank unit, best use RBK-500/SPBE
for other mechanized units, mixed soft-semi soft targets, use RBK-500/PTAB.

alright, end the test of panama campaigns.

[ccc]

I do a fly-tour over the whole panama land..

my impression - great job, the terrain is nicely tiled. objectives are placed properly.
Apart from few minor obj-linking bugs, the base work is done with hi-quality. Kudo to Malc.

i urge campaign-makers take a look at this mod and build more campaigns for it .. and don't let both sides burning bridges!!

[toonces]

Do you have any ideas/hypotheticals we could produce in this terrain?

I bought a board wargame a few months back called "Central America- America's Backyard War" with the intent to grab some Panama campaign ideas but, sadly, it focuses on Nicaragua and not Panama. And I'm just not all that familiar with the various militaries in this region.

[toonces]

I could maybe whip something up and call it an "exercise". Maybe a Red Flag sort of multinational exercise with a few different countries fighting a variety of aggressors? Any interest in something like that?

[Fafa]

CRUZEX ?

[Ripcord]

Maybe the drug lords take over Colombia? Civil war ensues, loyalist forces with the former government are pushed out, and take safe harbor in Panama where they regroup. US gets involved, etc.

If that is weak, then there is always Hugo Chavez in Venezuela, with Russian hardware and no shortagle of oil dollars -- say taken over northern part of Colombia with plans to seize the Panama canal zone and control ship traffic through there. US won't have that.

Sadly, whatever scenario you have there is going to be fictional, but at least there are some dubious figures/groups that could be theoretical enemies.

Ripcord

[ccc]

Alright i think this tweak should prevent both sides destroying bridges.. in SAVE1.cam.

TacEdit > Teams > Bonus/Priorities > change Objective-Bridge score to 0

just be sure to change each Team's priorities-bridge score to zero... or one side may still try to hit bridge.

OTOH..it means HUMAN player can help preventing your team to lose( or cheat? ) by destroying few bridges - once you destroy few critical bridges, both sides can not move further.. and end the war as stalemate.

[ccc]

To check my tweak ( stop burning bridges! ) in SAVE1.cam, i started a new campaign test( from RED side!)..

- the tweak seems work. all bridges keep intact.. nobody try to destory bridges.
- Red units moved to capture Santiago, then retreated back to Rio santa.. for unknown reason. Red ground units seem hesitate to fight against Blue armour units.. the situation last till day 2.
- i joined many Su-25 flights for AG missions. RBK-500SPBE/PTAB, ZAB and AS10/14 are quite effective against Blue ground units, tho not that good as blue counter parts..just have to spend few more ammo to achieve the same kills.
- the 23mm gun on Su25 is quite effective too.. the only shortcoming is 250 rounds.. one light vehicle may take near 100 rounds of ammo.
- the AA-8 is pretty good for helicopter target..once i encountered a pair of AH64, AA-8 can only locked on them from tail.. then one shot one kill. Too bad no code to make AH64 dropping chaff/flare. BTW - once Biker has a tip for helicopter-carried AAM: take Stinger for example, in database the stinger is set to be a [SAM] type weapon, so it can not be used and fired properly on helo. If you want a working stinger from helo, you must create a new CT entry for stinger, and set it as [ AAM] type weapon. you may imagine how dangerous it is heheh
- my Su-25 flying wiped out a lot of blue units, but Red units remained static for a long while..so i decide to manually order a mechanized unit move forward, at 64x time compression. As the unit moving west and capturing objectives, i noted more red units started following..it means the advance need one or two units take lead, then the rest follows. The following units did not limit themselves along the main combat route..they also moved to capture several obj at branch roads..just amazing.
- As all bridges remain intact, and my direct-control unit kept moving forward..Blue AI got mad with my aggressiveness .. Blue units kept moving east to engage my spearhead unit. sometimes i've to drive my unit backward for a break, and i jumped into su25 flights to wipe out blue units.
- on day 3, my spearhead unit had reached Tole AFB area. Like i reported, it got some road bug.. and i encountered more blue resistance. Since Red side controlled the sky( more ac in this campaign ), flying Su25 is a pleasure..fast in, fast out..the A-G job is done effectively.
- my impression so far is, this campaign becomes winable with [no-destroy bridge] edit. BUT, whether campaign brain can capture the objectives to win by iteself, is unknown. my current campaign status is excellent, but the ground op still aimed at PAK-Santiago, AI has not change its op focus to pak-David...so the whole ground force lacked a drive to rush toward west .. maybe later. If not, it could be obj priority value issue..just too low to draw attention, like the case in Kurile.
- during the fly in 3d world..i saw tu22, mig29/su27 flying overhead, mi8/24 flying low..well, total air superiosity once seen in this virtal scenerio

[ccc]

Alright.. I win.. again



on Day 4 0450, one unit captured Dolega obj, and ended the war.
I've to admit i "rush" the progress of war by directly moving one unit to my desired obj, thus ending the war in mush less time than those driven automatically by campaign AI.

BUT- during my last lag of maenuvoring, i noticed few things..

- once my spearhead unit moving foreward, i found several units started following, more and more units gather toward my way.
- once my spearhead unit encountered hostile ground units, Su25 sq started to generate lots FAC, BAI, and On call CAS sorties.
- once my speardhead unit getting close to objective- David, i noticed the ground op focus changed to PAK-David.. means ground operation AI can shift its op focus from Santiago to David.. IF no human intervention, the campaign brain has good chance to do it, automatically.
- in the very last stage, i moved on unit from David to capture Dolega.. well it just refused to do it( to end the war). So i ordered it keep moving to north... then two more units followed it..and one unit turned to captured Dolega automatically and ended the war!
- as the pic shows, there's a yellow box area..a road [move cost value] bug is found.



Between San Cristobal and San Felix, there's a San Felix bridge. the [move cost value] between San Cristobal and San Felix bridge is extrordinarily high up to 140, for all units. This bug makes ground unis have hard time to pass it.. my spearhead unit took long time to pass that section of road( as thin yellow line). AI units refuse to follow, or detour. i've to order another unit move along the thicker white line route via Curuonte, then the rest units followed happily.

the bug can be fixed with TacEdit. delete old obj link between the two obj, re-link, done. the [move cost] down to around 10.

To sum up..

- for SAVE1.cam, it's playable and winable.
- it needs a TacEdit tweak to [ change team bonus/priorites score down to zero], to stop burning bridges.
- it needs some TacEdit tweak to fix road bugs at Tole AFB, and San Felix bridge area.

[ccc]

few tweaking report:

- when delete obj-linking and re-link obj, the edit changes panama.thr file.

once it edited, the tweak applies to all panama *.cam.. including all saved *.cam files.

- As i reported before, the obj linking edit can only work on *.cam, not on *.tac file. it remains true.

i tried to fix San Felix bridge bug in TE.tac, no go. it won't save. Even i rename *.tac to *.cam, do the edit, then rename it back to *.tac, it remains unchanged.

according to PMC wiki, a basic TE is created from a *.cam file..so.. a good autosave.tac better be created(again) from a bug-fixed ).cam.

[Snake Man]

I create the .cam obectives first, then export and import them into te_new.tac file.

[ccc]

http://www.mediafire.com/file/zy3xaym2z ... -save1.zip

the zip contains my tweaked panama.thr, save1.cam, and the default te_new.tac.

feel free to check if the bug fix works, check the [move cost value] between San Felix and San Felix bridge.

[toonces]

Can anyone tell me where to download the most recent version of this campaign?

All of the links I have for download no longer work.

[derStef]

yeah, plz pass us the needed files over to install that version of Panama, i possible!

thx Stef

[ccc]

Hope Fafa or Snake Man can help you... the file link for FF4/RV is gone, no file there.

[Snake Man]

Well I naturally cant remember that far back of the details what files I downloaded, but I checked to my theater Incoming dir and I have panama source files rar which contains:

F4Panama_v2.exe - 23.5mb
panama-af_v1-01.exe - 36.8mb
PanamaBMS.exe - 3.8mb
PanamaBMS2SP42.exe - 9.7mb
PanamaOF.exe - 10.2mb

Then panama new files rar which contains:

panama.pak
panama.thr
te_new.tac

I haven't got around to do any work for these since Malc created this topic, sorry.

[toonces]

I guess I'm looking for whatever files ccc used to get Panama installed into FF4; which should work more or less for FF5.

I can then look at ccc's tweaks posted above.

So, if ccc (or whomever) can let me know if any of those files you posted match, then we're in business. I was under the impression fafa had created a FF4/RV specific installer.

Otherwise I'm sort of DIW on working on this theater at all.

[Fafa]

I guess I'm looking for whatever files ccc used to get Panama installed into FF4; which should work more or less for FF5.

I can then look at ccc's tweaks posted above.

So, if ccc (or whomever) can let me know if any of those files you posted match, then we're in business. I was under the impression fafa had created a FF4/RV specific installer.

Otherwise I'm sort of DIW on working on this theater at all.

Originally Posted by Fafa
Here are the links for the FF panama version, some stuffs are remaining but I haven't got time. Some campaigns seems to work due to the fact the CT used are the same than OF/AF.

FF5 -> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=76WY5GT0

FF4 -> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DC1HE2TR

1/ For FF4 version you must copy the entire objects folder of the terrdata root to theater/panama because the TDF is pointing to that link...or edit the TDF to point to the default FF objects folder.

2/Don't forget the line to the theater.lst
Theaters\Panama\Panama.tdf

[toonces]

Got em fafa.

If you don't want those "public" you need to pull them down.

Toro posted the link to them at FreeFalcon. I was under the impression they were still under development.

[Fafa]

No problem, it's public

[toonces]

I had an opportunity (finally) to goof off with this theater last night. My impressions follow:

Clearly, somebody (Malc?) has put a lot of love into this theater. When ccc suggested campaign builders utilize Panama to design scenarios, I was somehow under the impression that the existing ones weren't that great. I was definitely wrong on that score. The two scenarios I looked at (one CTDs on my as noted by ccc above), they have clearly been crafted carefully. I didn't spend an excessive amount of time looking at the guts, but my initial impressions are that the current campaigns in Panama are probably very good to go. I would like to work to bring them up to the FF5 DB, because there are some obvious DB conflicts in the campaign.

This is definitely what I have in mind when I'm thinking about creating campaigns/theaters though. Panama is a nice, tight-playing theater. The unit density/air density is very managable. In all of my sorties, I felt like I could set up my engagement and focus more on the engagement and less on the utter craziness that some of my sorties degenerate to in larger theaters.

My next thought is that, while the existing campaigns are very well done (from what I could see), this theater is a very strong candidate for exercise-type scenarios. CRUZEX would fit very well here. My Tropic Thunder idea would work too, but it might be even better/more appropriate to alter Tropic Thunder to fit into Heavy Metal, and make it an OOB edit rather than gut the theater. It really just doesn't seem to need much work to be honest.

Finally, well, maybe I've been sleeping under a rock, but I'm surprised this theater hasn't generated more discussion. It appears to be 90% ready to go, just some edges to be smoothed, some links and DB conflicts to be fixed, and maybe a bit of tweaking on the ground OOB to "inspire" AI ground movement to objectives.

Overall, this is one nice package. I look forward to working on, and PLAYING! this theater some more this weekend!

Kudos to the Panama Team!

[ccc]

Glad you got it..finally

say..i found Malc still missed something in his campaigns.. he should place MANY tanker/container ship units in the Canal area, to simulate the extremely heavy traffic there! Of course, all these civil ships should be listed as some neutral side!

[toonces]

That's a great idea ccc.

Does Malc come around here anymore? I'd like to coordinate with him.

The CRUZEX idea intrigues me. I really think I can generate something interesting here, capitalizing on the FF5 planeset. I'd really like to get Malc in here though; somehow it doesn't seem right to alter the hard work he's done without some sort of coordination with him as the theater creator.

[Fafa]

In my own experience when tacediting campaigns for AEGEAN FF5, I realized, you should keep all the ground unit, actions etc...and work only on editing the A/C which are the most changed in all DB versions. So something could be available very quickly.

For me CRUZEX should be adapted with specific local A/C almost available in the FF DB.

If you're ok to edit a campaign to use those A/C i could give you some skins to include in a pack.

Now CCC has a very good idea simulating naval civil activity which could be done too without any problem.

[derStef]

tried ccc's save1 out but got a CTD every time when i tried to start (commit) the campaign, on the selection screen...

any ideas?