ReadL2 Util

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-25 09:46:00

ReadL2 Util - to fix those tiles in our terrains.

More to follow soon.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-25 17:39:00

Great Util

Love it

best birthdaypresent I had up to now
don't think it will be supassed tonight..

Widmak

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-25 17:51:00

Happy birthday, Widowmaker

And I'll remember you this post when it will be mine (birthday)

Regards.

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-25 18:45:00

ReadL2 Utility by Skyfire76

Util that reads your autotiled (or whatever) theater.L2 file, scans for tiles by your rules that you are written in the configuration file. It changes tiles based on the elevation, so for example you can set it to tile desert tiles to 1-1000ft, darker mountain tiles for 1000-3000ft etc, it will know how to adjust all your road and river tiles according to the configuration file rules.

It Rules. capish?

If you are still confused (like I am most of the time), here is the screenshots.

Light brown mountains

Dark brown mountains

Behalf of the terrain community, Thank you Skyfire76 !

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-25 18:51:00

We got a winner..

now how about a util
that can set X1 X2 X2 values
for all terrain offsets at once

this way we can alter Fog intensity/color
Fog far/near
at once and get rid of the fog in the dessert

Widmak

brewskie · Post by **brewskie** » 2002-02-25 22:08:00

That is just outstanding, but these examples are for flat terrains, I wonder what you get when mountains and hills are involved like in Nam and Balkans.

ccc · Post by **ccc** » 2002-02-26 00:49:00

GREAT job Skyfire!!

BTW, happy birthday Widmkr!

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-26 08:48:00

[quote]quote:Originally posted by Widowmaker:
We got a winner..

Regards.

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-26 10:06:00

[quote]quote:Originally posted by Skyfire76:
On a last note, I think we need a better name for this small util : ReadL2 is really lame. Your suggestions are welcome

I'm not sure if you are familiar with Dr. Fred Balding's LODFixer utility which replaces specified tiles with 4-tile-set's. It works much like yours but it does not check any altitudes. I used it to create the "autotiling" generic tiles for the latest ODS install.

It would be cool to have the same 4-tile-set tile replacer function to your "ReadL2" util also, kind of having all the features under one tool.

Also I can dig up you some great autotiling ideas what we theater pimps have been planning for some time now. We just lack the coding ability... until now

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-26 10:37:00

Well, it's not an autotiler, so it does not deserve that title

) ? GATE is not bad IMHO.

I don't know LODfixer at all, so you'll have to explain to me what is this 4-tiles-set feature you're talking about.

Other ideas : yeah, why not ? Me thinks I'm gonna soon be busy

Regards.

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-26 11:58:00

quote:Originally posted by Skyfire76:
I suppose you're talking about the three bytes we were discussing the other day ?

So, if I understand well, you would want to force these three bytes to given values whatever the tile they apply to ?

If so, it's perfectly doable.

On a last note, I think we need a better name for this small util : ReadL2 is really lame. Your suggestions are welcome

Regards.

Exactly what I mean..

as for the name.. Terrainfire (Skyfire.. terrain.. get it?? )

just a idea.. lol

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-26 12:03:00

TerrainFire ? If that's all you can come up with, I'll think about go and find another group with better ideas

(just kidding

)

OK, your idea is noted, and should not be hard to implement. I have to check some doc. that Snake Man sent me and see how all this can fit together.

Regards.

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-26 12:09:00

I got multiple ideas myslef as far as height/steepnes manipulation

will leave this for now..

the 4byte offset SM is refering about works like this

F4UT incresed the tileoffset range
from a 2byte to a 4byte thingie
this way we can have more then 65000 tiles in the terrain (all levels combined)

mayby SM van set you up with are 4byte theater

Balkans ODS Iceland and Vietnam will all have the 4byte ofset so we can have a more diverse terrain.

Widmak

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-26 12:20:00

OK, I see (I think

).

If you have other ideas, please send them (by email) : as said above, SnakeMan sent me some, and I need to see if all this can fit together.

Regards.

Zaggy · Post by **Zaggy** » 2002-02-26 16:00:00

Skyfire, has SM sent you my little project doco for a util that we christened 'PathTiler'??? I have more idea's for PathTiler since the project paper was written as well...

As for the fog in the desert, we should keep some, but colour it like sand, so we get a hazy, slight sand storm effect... Particularly in the more barren regions... Keep it nice and clear over the fertile area's and mountains, but let it degenerate into a slight Haze in the middle of the barren area's... Just my opinion... But that grey haze just doesn't look right in the middle of the day...

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-26 16:37:00

Yes, I have it, but as I said to SM and WM, I'm not very good when it comes to develop graphical programs

I've read it, and for now, I do not have too much hope to be able to do it.

But if you have a more detailed doc. about it, feel free to send it to me (maybe it's just because I do not understand how all this could be done that I don't think I can do it).

Regards.

Zaggy · Post by **Zaggy** » 2002-02-26 18:16:00

Skyfire, u ever frequent IRC??? If so, we'll organise a time where SM, WM and I can be there and we'll go thru the PathTiler concept...

codec · Post by **codec** » 2002-02-27 08:11:00

Hey Skyfire,
nice program - excellent idea, and another tool in the terrain toolbox!

On the subject of haze, this just affects the X1 byte, and I think you could do this in a similar way.

All we need really is (I think)
<tile> <hazevalue>
so for all tiles with the given number, set X1 to that value.
It might be better if it also has an altitude component, so perhaps
<tile> <alt1> <haze1> <alt2> <haze2> ....
As I think, but don't know for sure, that the lower altitudes have more haze.

Julian.

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-27 09:11:00

@ Zaggy : Sorry, as I already said (IIRC) to SM and WM, I don't have an Internet connection at home (too expensive here in France, IMHO), and here at work, I'm only allowed to HTTP and SMTP (and maybe FTP). So emails and forums will be the only way for us to talk, I'm afraid.

@ codec : thanks, but the idea is not mine (SM and WM's one), and so far, this program was not that hard to make

The hardest, in fact, was to figure out the O2 and L2 format with really little info.

About your new rules, this seems perfectly doable, at first sight. I think WM should tell us what he thinks about it and how he would want to integrate it with the new version I sent him this morning.

Regards.

codec · Post by **codec** » 2002-02-27 11:54:00

quote:Originally posted by Skyfire76:
[b@ codec : thanks, but the idea is not mine (SM and WM's one), and so far, this program was not that hard to make The hardest, in fact, was to figure out the O2 and L2 format with really little info.
Regards.

Anything more you need to know about 02/L2 files, let me know. I can tell you most of it.

Julian.

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-27 12:30:00

Thanks for the offer.

I indeed still have some doubts about specific points, but at this time, I don't really need to know the answers. Maybe when more features are included in our new tool

Regards.

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-27 20:49:00

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/F4Iceland ... andAlt.jpg

This is not the end result.. just a testshot
what we can do with CATE right now
is very very cool..
I need some time to get the RanAlt script optimized
and start using the TileRule script well but the potential of the current vesrion is awesome.
especialy with the replace tile by a random string of tiles of TV.

Widmak

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-27 21:48:00

quote:Originally posted by codec:
On the subject of haze, this just affects the X1 byte, and I think you could do this in a similar way.

All we need really is (I think)
<tile> <hazevalue>
so for all tiles with the given number, set X1 to that value.
It might be better if it also has an altitude component, so perhaps
<tile> <alt1> <haze1> <alt2> <haze2> ....
As I think, but don't know for sure, that the lower altitudes have more haze.

Julian.

This can already be done with the version
I got today.... when starting with
a new terrain all a matter with doing things in the right order

However when a terrain is already tiled or
partially tiled it would become less easy
but doable
(very long scripts..due to more Tile ID's)

Iceland will make extensive use of this
I think ODS will just use the X1 = 255
over the whole terrian as the Dessert
and fog somehow don't go together the way it is now with value set to 254
but thats up to Snakeman to decide

Widmak

ccc · Post by **ccc** » 2002-02-27 22:23:00

AWESOME! so Iceland theater is almost done overnight?

can it be done in 128x128 scale? more water, more naval operation!

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-27 22:35:00

nope not overnight

but a whoile lot of things have become easier and some are now doable
(changing X1 to 255 on every tile can be rather tedious..

)

hmm that would mean 128 hires iceland...
lemme think..

512 segment terrain
128 cam file.. pff

first problem would be DEM map
in those nothern hemisphres you reach the
max at Globeserver very soon
second Dem2LF is not up to it..
(Hd space, processing time) etc..

nope don't think so
there is lots of water
no worries..

Widmak

brewskie · Post by **brewskie** » 2002-02-27 22:53:00

It's like Genesis

That's what i wanted to see.

Nice to see Codec here, awesome job on SP2, realism has indeed achieved a new level.

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-28 04:50:00

quote:Originally posted by hhheagle:
How does one acquire ReadL2 ?

You and krfrge were the first guys to ask for it, nice to see Skyfires util kicks off with warm welcome

If Skyfire does not oppose it, the CAKE util should appear in the downloads with some PMC tutorial soon. Very soon.

quote:I'm confused: I understand DEM2LF is unavailable

We are slightly off topic here, but ...
If you mean Miran Klemenc's DEM2L2 Spherical Converter - the ONLY converter you should use for new terrains now, yes its not downloadable. But if you see the download section it says you can have it just by emailing me "can I have it?"

quote:I modified Julians' PERL script to create a 128x128

No, no. Email me and you'll receive DEM2L2 Spherical converter in no time.

quote:eBalkan does NOT load (I get lots of 'space' between each tile) into TerrainView.

Its 4byte theater.L2 file - Terrainview does not read those. But I've heard stuff that there is fix for it - coming or existing already, I'm not sure.

quote:if I do all this work in a 'theater', how far will I have to back up to make it work ... f4108US e110 ?

We are going so off topic that I'll kick myself soon

You will work on the 2byte theater.L2 file with latest terrainview from our downloads. Whats the difference between 2byte and 4byte L2's you say? Well 2byte is the old format with less fartile textures (65355 or something), 4byte is the new format with high amount of fartiles. LODFixer is what converts 2byte L2's into 4bytes - there is no going back after you convert.

quote:Should I just hang up my socks until an SP2 TerrainBuilder comes out ?

There is no SP2 terrainbuilder.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-28 09:25:00

quote:Originally posted by Snake Man:
You and krfrge were the first guys to ask for it, nice to see Skyfires util kicks off with warm welcome
If Skyfire does not oppose it, the CAKE util should appear in the downloads with some PMC tutorial soon. Very soon.
PMC TFW
Snake Man

Yep, very nice, thanks for the welcome everybody

Of course, you can put the utility in the download section if you wish. Absolutely no problem with that. However :

- it's CATE, and not CAKE (lol

) : Configurable Auto Tiling Enhancer (thanks to T-Rex for the idea)

- there will be an updated version soon : WidowMaker sent me some ideas, which look easy to implement, and I still have to answer to you, SnakeMan , about not so easy ideas (very hard, in fact, for me at least

)

Regards.

Widowmaker · Post by **Widowmaker** » 2002-02-28 12:05:00

yup autoliing rivers and roads is pretty complicated

I'dd first like to set up a proposal for coastal tiling
as this is a bit simpler to get an overview on
Gimmy some time to work it out..

Widmak

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-28 13:03:00

Autotiling features (roads/rivers/cities) with CATE?

Would that be possible?

PMC TFW
Snake Man

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-02-28 14:09:00

Here is small example image I prepared to explain the 4-tile-set autotiling replace thingy.
http://www.pmctactical.org/f4/screensho ... xample.jpg

In the actual segment screenshot you see road and a river (features) which are not effected by the fourtileset because it searches the terrain for that plain desert tile and if it founds 4 of them, it replaces them with our specified tiles.

In this case Zaggy mopped up some nice 4 tile sets, meaning the tiles itself are unusable but together in
1 - 2
3 - 4
Sets they complete the "image" or terrain feature, will it be rock or desert foliage or other stuff. Also I used some earlier normal tiles, the transition tiles to create those "star" shaped patterns. That segment also has many 4-tile-sets of just plain same default desert texture, so everything is not our autotiled stuf (you cannot see default tiles being autotiled heh)

Uhm I'm no good making images or explaining these things, please Widow/Zaggy/anyone step in and help me out

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-02-28 14:23:00

Errrhh, yes, some more explanations would be welcome : to be honest, the only thing I understood is you want me to search for a given 4 tiles pattern, and replace it with another 4 tiles set.

And I'm not even sure of this

Regards.

T_Rex · Post by **T_Rex** » 2002-02-28 20:10:00

quote:Originally posted by Skyfire76:
Configurable Auto Tiling Enhancer (thanks to T-Rex for the idea)

Cool! So now I get royalties off of it, right!

Wait...what's this...something about free program.... DOH!

Back to the Bering Straits with me!

ccc · Post by **ccc** » 2002-03-01 01:02:00

Bering straits? sounds like USA vs USSR? Invading Alaska!

T_Rex · Post by **T_Rex** » 2002-03-01 04:00:00

LOL

Yep, something like that. I had a whole big scenario worked up where (some time after the fictional ME campaign) the US and Russia work together to drill 3 huge oil platforms in the Bering Straits. One thing leads to another and there's a shooting war! Lotsa chance for Naval action, too.

I've got the stuff for Alaska (somewhere around here) but need the Russia stuff.

Some day, some day...after ME, after Afghanistan. Maybe in time for FV!

Zaggy · Post by **Zaggy** » 2002-03-01 04:14:00

my god they were horrible tiles SM... Im embarrased to have created them... You could have atleast used the 4tile, tilable sets...

Sky, what would be more useful than the ability to tile in blocks of 4tiles would be this...

The ability to tile an area using a set of (for example) 16 different tiles, tiled randomly after each other... COMBINED WITH the ability for the software to identify the transition between generic tiles and feature tiles, and place the appropriate TRANSITIONAL tile....

ie: tile an area, then tile the border of the area so it blends in with the feature tiles nice and naturally....

If you need pics to describe this, just ask...

PMC Youtube channel · Post by **Snake Man** » 2002-03-01 06:04:00

quote:Originally posted by Zaggy:
If you need pics to describe this, just ask...

Yes please, post some example images.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-03-01 09:06:00

quote:Originally posted by T_Rex:
Cool! So now I get royalties off of it, right!

*sigh* I knew I should not have mentionned you, T-Rex. Man now I fear you could someday come to France, and that I have to meet you

I'm lucky I did this as a free program

Regards.

Skyfire76 · Post by **Skyfire76** » 2002-03-01 09:07:00

quote:Originally posted by Snake Man:
Yes please, post some example images.

PMC TFW
Snake Man

Hehe, I'll second that

Regards.

Who is online